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| Bode |
 Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2004 11:30 pm Post subject: SOLOING |
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Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Posts: 2033
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Hello everybody! Due to popular request, (well, actually its only from one person...suicide-by-overdrive...he he...I know I'm pathetic), I have decided to start a thread on the art and theory of probably the most mysterious aspect of guitar ....SOLOING...( Eddie Van Halen's 'Eruption' playing in the background...yeah baby...heh heh...).
omarjamaludin will be covering certain aspects, to start with, the theory behind scales and modes and its’ other derivatives and I will be covering the application of this theory to practice. I will also be covering certain techniques pertaining to soloing. This is not by all means a complete guitar course, but more of like stuff you won’t find in books or internet, or things that I wished somebody told me when I was learning to play. This thread is supposed to more of a discussion, and other people are invited to contribute and share their knowledge to further enhance our knowledge. I hope that I can learn from everybody and at the same time hopefully I can contribute something in return.
To start with, here is omarjamaludin explaining the concept of scales and modes in the next post : |
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| Bode |
| Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2004 11:33 pm Post subject: Scales and modes |
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Joined: 03 Feb 2004
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This was originally posted by omarjamaludin in another thread, but I copied and paste it here :
first off you must know what a major scale ,which is the do re mi fa so la ti do .. it's supposed to be a very happy sounding scale as opposed to some of the modes and of course the minor scale ( which some ppl say sounds devilish )
the structure or progression for major scale goes like this
W W H W W W H
I know you are going 'what the helll ?? Ws and Hs? but let's take a few moment to understand what it means..
W W H W W W H
1) W stands for whole step which is basically going up/down two frets on the fretboard , like going from note C to D
2)H - half step is just going up/down one fret . like going from note E to F
so for sake of simplicity let's create our C major scale from the given pattern
when u apply the W W H W W W H pattern starting from C ,
you will get C major scale as shown below..
C -w- D -w- E -h- F -w- G -w- A -w- B -h- C
as you can see starting from C , go up whole step (W) you'll get D , go up another whole step you'll get a E , go up half-step (H) you'll get an F and so on according to the W W H W W W H pattern
so the major scales would be C D E F G A B C
you can try this one your guitar and it will give the that happy sounding doremi scale
the W W H W W W H progression is true for all major scales ..let say if you take F note .. the major scale would be
F-w- G -w- A -h- Bb -w- C -w- D -w- E -h- F
which gives us the F major scale - F G A Bb C D E F
so get a hold on this first :
1)what is major scale
2)it's note progression - the W W H W W W H
3) practice on your guitar
then esok aku citer lagi how all scales (modes , harmonic , melodic minor , etc) are derived from this major scale ... like the phrygian mode which is used by metallica alot in their metal days... |
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| Bode |
| Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2004 11:35 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 03 Feb 2004
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Aku tengah ada research work bertimbun ni, so at the moment aku menyengap sat...tapi aku promise aku nanti mai balik cakap pasal diff aspects of soloing.
omarjamaludin...why dont you carry on? Everybody is welcomed to contribute anyway...aku nak belajar juga ni... |
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| Bode |
| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2004 12:10 am Post subject: Polyrhythms and meter layering |
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Joined: 03 Feb 2004
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| Well..this thread dont have to be strictly on soloing..any theory and skill related thing can be covered kan? Ridzi...Polyrhythms and meter layering...yang ni ko kene ajar aku...aku tak paham sangat la...and anything to make rhythm playing to sound tight... |
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| omarjamaludin |
| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2004 1:24 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 18 Feb 2004
Posts: 2615
Location: Tmn Melawati
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What is you mode today? introduction to modes
well hopefully some of you have grasped the idea of major scale and it's structure...if not i'd suggest read that post bout major scale first b4 we go into modes n other stuff..
pls review the W W H W W W H progression as this would be later referred to again and again.. i cannot stress how important this innocent looking major scale is to getting the skills necessary for some death metal soloing ..er atleast rock soloing hehe..
Most of the time people use major or minor scale , esp during baroque/classical period . Modes have been around for quite some time well b4 1600..sometime it is also known as the church mode cos Roman church back in those days use modes for their chorale n stuff ..
7 types of mode scales exist , and they are named after some ancient greece town :
1)Ionian - this is the major scale
2)Dorian - minor sound , used by metallica sometimes , and country music too
3)Phrygian - evil spanish sounding scale - mostly used by metal guitarist (metallica too)
4)Lydian - jazz / blues - stevie ray vaughan used this alot
5)Mixolydian - sweet sounding jazz bluez , stevie ray is a big fan of this mode combined with blues scale
6)Aeolian - this is where we get our minor scale , it's natural minor
7) Locrian - due to tonal instability people do not use this very much...very low minor sounding scale..
Okay guys so we gonna go into detail bout modes n it's structure..so pay extra attention to this posting..tak lama lagi boleh goreng mcm kirk hammet haha..aku nak mandi sat..
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Last edited by omarjamaludin on Sun Feb 22, 2004 1:57 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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| omarjamaludin |
| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2004 2:20 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 18 Feb 2004
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Okay ..aku tak jadi nak mandi..weather tgh sejuk dan semalam snowing skit..you know how ppl say mat salleh tak mandi 2 hari? well it's true hehe..but dont worry guys..for health and personal hygiene reasons i will take my shower right after finishing this mode stuff...
let's go into modes in details..
what is your mode today? - mode's structure and it's relationship to major scale
let's start by taking the C major scale..i know some ppl say why C major? it's because C major does not have any sharps or flats so it'll be easier for me to explain and for you to understand ..
lets have the C major scale going from low pitch to high pitch:
C D E F G A B C
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
Please remember that C note is the first degree of the major scale , D note is the second degree , E is third and so on..
Ionian mode (1st degree)
So let's start with Ionian mode. Ionian scale is the same thing as your major scale , meaning it has the same structure ( W W H W W W H)
so it would be C D E F G A B C ..okay so nothing new here..just to let you know that when ppl say Ionian mode, dont panic! it is just the major scale..
Dorian (second degree)
Dorian scale is what you will get if you start the C major scale from note D instead of note C . This is called the second degree mode because it starts from the second degree of major scale , which in our case is the note D
so let's take our major scale again
C D E F G A B C
and let's start from the second degree of the scale which is note D and let it progress one octave to a higher pitch D note
D E F G A B C D
so that my friends , is the D Dorian scale .
It is a D scale ( just like D major or D minor) because it's key tonic is D or in plain english - it is in the key of D .. later Bode would explain how to apply this in soloing but basically if somebody is doing a rhythm chord progression in Dm key..you can use D Dorian scale to goreng like crazy.. then proudly say to your rhythm guitarist ..'aku tgh goreng D dorian niii' mesti dia ternganga kejap..hehe
ok back to business...we're not done yet with Dorian let alone the other 5 modes..
So let's review D dorian again ,
we've got the D Dorian from C major scale ...
from C D E F G A B C (c major scale)
and now start the scale from D instead of C , we'll get
D E F G A B C D (this D Dorian )
Now pause for a minute , remember the structure for C major scale ?
W W H W W W H
Since we we started from D for our Dorian mode , the structure too have changed..
now instead of
W W H W W W H (major scale structure)
we would start from the second degree and get this this structure
W H W W W H W (dorian scale structure)
let's see again how is this applied to D dorian..
D E F G A B C D
D W E H F W G W A W B H C W D
So the D Dorian mode conforms to the W H W W W H W structure..
ok at least we've got two modes ( ionian and dorian ) out of the way..
i'm gonna post more stuff about the rest of the modes esp my favourite phyrgian (any metalheads should know this) and mixolydian ( essential for blues/jazz fan) .. but hopefully by now you guys already know how to derive modes from major scale ... all other modes work in the same way..
recap this post -
1)Ionian - major scale - starts from C note
(starts from 1st degree which is C)
2)Dorian - starts from D note (2nd degree)
other modes that you guys can start finding out by your self before i go more into details:
3)Phrygian - starts from E note (3rd degree)
4) Lydian - starts from F note (4th degree)
5)Mixolydian - starts from G note (5th degree)
6)Aeolian - starts from A note ( this is A minor scale basically, so A aeolian is always A minor scale) (6th degree)
7) Locrian - starts from B note (7th degree)
So later on i would expain bit more on the rest of the modes and their scale structure .. hopefully then we can go into (if anybody need to know lah)
- three types of minor scale
- minor pentatonic and it's box pattern on your guitar
- and the dirtiest ballsiest scale ever - the blues scale (my fav)
-blues and jazz chord progression
anyway somebody needs to treat me sup ekor and nasi pataya masa aku balik for all this work haha.
ok assalamualaikum..aku nak mandi ..hari ni ada potluck dan aku masak laksa....which laksa u might ask? the only laksa worth to be called laksa ..the laksa asam kedah ...
what la laksa johor...hahaha relax orang johor! 
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Last edited by omarjamaludin on Sun Feb 22, 2004 2:41 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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| GryMlock |
| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2004 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 24 Nov 2003
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Location: Agombak Ago go!
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this is an excellent thread. I'll look into the possibility of converting this to article style. Bleh create subtopics, categories. I know I've seen it been implemented somewhere but tak ingat lak kat mana.
ps. ehem.. laksa johor tak laksa la ya?
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| omarjamaludin |
| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2004 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 18 Feb 2004
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oops lupa bos besar orang johor haha..
sebenarnya dua - dua adalah laksa , but my bias goes in favor of laksa asam cos
1) mak aku orang utara
2) aku tak reti masak laksa johor hehe..laksa asam reti la..
and come on..have maggi released maggi laksa johor?? hehehe think bout that eh...
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| GryMlock |
| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2004 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 24 Nov 2003
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Location: Agombak Ago go!
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| suicide-by-overdrive |
| Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 12:19 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 18 Feb 2004
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Location: Petaling Jaya/TTDI Kuala Lumpur
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laksa johor best apa??gua layan weiii....  |
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| omarjamaludin |
| Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 1:03 pm Post subject: |
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my bad...ok no more kutuking laksa johor haha...
so i wonder if ppl reallly read what i've explained bout modes..
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| GryMlock |
| Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 1:43 pm Post subject: |
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| lizard |
| Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:45 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 01 Jan 2004
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| betul betul... karang melalut sampai cite jiran aku bela ayam tanpa kebenaran majlis pembandaran shah alam.. and topic nie best.. aku dah boleh solo dalam scale 2nd degree dorian scale ape ke lancau.. |
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| suicide-by-overdrive |
| Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 18 Feb 2004
Posts: 346
Location: Petaling Jaya/TTDI Kuala Lumpur
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| omarjamaludin wrote: | my bad...ok no more kutuking laksa johor haha...
so i wonder if ppl reallly read what i've explained bout modes.. |
omar,
aku baca semua explanation pasal theory music yg ko tulis tu.
bagus cara ko explain.ko amik course music ke dulu2??? |
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| omarjamaludin |
| Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 18 Feb 2004
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aku ada ambik course introduction to music kat sini which basically ajar about scales and chords relationship , intervals etc.. ...pastu lain byk baca artikel kat internet mcm modes , pentatonic stuff ..
thanks for the compliment dude..i'll post more stuff later on....
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