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| ultraman_cosmo |
 Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 9:00 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 1665
Location: Mines resort city
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| deadzid wrote: | ah pening2....
so basically kalau aku pakai ME-70,
kalau root note aku Em...
aku kena set harmonizer key to G...
pastu amek mode yang 3rd eh?
is that correct??
haiyah...
kalau ade function utk tukar minor / major kan senang...
tak payah susah2 nak pilih note pasangan.... |
- kalo ko nak main Em scaling, ME70 set to Gmaj la zid.
- aha, amik mode 3rd laaa. tu jer.
- Pas tu main jer laaa cam biasa.
- diaorang tak buat major an minor sebab boss angap semua musian akan tahu semua scaling Major akan ada relative nya minor. Gmaj = Em scale.
Lepas korang try 3rd,5th, dan ovtave.
- Korang boleh try 2nd, 4th, 6th and 7th juga.
- aku sebenarnya suka 6th dan 7th sebab ia sound jazzy.
- 6th sound macam 13thchord manakala 7th sound macam chord 7th.
- kalo 2 guitar main serentak, bunyi macam moving melodic chord jazz.
- 2nd@9th pun syok juga, tapi not sound great pada rock tune.
Contoh 4th degree harmonic utk Cmajor.
C = 4th harmonic adalah F
D = 4th harmonic adalah G
E = 4th harmonic adalah A
F = 4th harmonic adalah B
G = 4th harmonic adalah C
A = 4th harmonic adalah D
B = 4th harmonic adalah E
So kao kita ada solo
Phrase C-D-E-D-C
- So 2nd guitar solo boleh main F-G-A-G-F (4th degree harmonic dalam Cmajor scaling
Contoh 6th degree harmonic utk Cmajor.
C = 6th harmonic adalah A
D = 6th harmonic adalah B
E = 6th harmonic adalah C
F = 6th harmonic adalah D
G = 6th harmonic adalah E
A = 6th harmonic adalah F
B = 6th harmonic adalah G
So kao kita ada solo
Phrase C-D-E-D-C
- So 2nd guitar solo boleh main A-B-C-B-A (6th degree harmonic dalam Cmajor scaling
- 6th degree harmonic utk Cmajor scale adalah = A minor scale.
- Macam korag cakap sebelom ne, 1 guitar main major scale dan 2nd guitar main minor scale.
Hope tak confuse bila kita kata 9th ,11th dan 13th degree.
- kalo korang back to the basis music interval, nanti faham laaa.
- Serous tak susah. cuma perlukan pemahaman.
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| poundcake |
| Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 1:45 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 17 Feb 2004
Posts: 1100
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sekarang mari kita mainkan intro Alam Barzakh-Wings... 
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| ETERNAL |
| Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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sebenarnya aku agak confuse dengan minor scale...
is minor chord is the same as minor scale?
Setau aku Major scale mmg ade..
tapi minor scale mcm tak wujud.. kecuali harmonic minor or melodic minor...
which sounds like arabic or latin or pop yeh yeh
kalau kita main major chord e.g Cmaj
We are actually playing C ionian scale
kalau kita main minor chord e.g. Am...
We are actually playing A aeolian scale (which equally to C ionian scale)
so correct me if im wrong...
so Minor Chord does not really fit minor scale.. it is still in major scale itself
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Last edited by ETERNAL on Tue Mar 16, 2010 4:19 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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| poundcake |
| Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:48 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 17 Feb 2004
Posts: 1100
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| ETERNAL wrote: | sebenarnya aku agak confuse dengan minor scale...
is minor chord is the same as minor scale?
Setau aku Major scale mmg ade..
tapi minor scale mcm tak wujud.. kecuali harmonic minor or melodic minor...
which sounds like arabic or latin or pop yeh yeh
kalau kita main major chord e.g Cmaj
We area actually playing C ionian scale
kalau kita main minor chord e.g. Am...
We area actually playing A aeolian scale (which equally to C ionian scale)
so correct me if im wrong...
so Minor Chord does not really fit minor scale.. it is still in major scale itself |
haha... natural minor scale satu lagi...sama macam major scale tapi ROOT note dia yg beza.. dia kira sixth degree of major scale... kita konpiuskan dengan nama natural minor scale..atau kita panggil jugak mode Aeolian..
minor chord ni just apabila kita flatted-kan 3rd dia je..
*sorry for bahasa 1 rojak malaysia*
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| ultraman_cosmo |
| Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 3:31 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 1665
Location: Mines resort city
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| ETERNAL wrote: | sebenarnya aku agak confuse dengan minor scale...
is minor chord is the same as minor scale?
Setau aku Major scale mmg ade..
tapi minor scale mcm tak wujud.. kecuali harmonic minor or melodic minor...
which sounds like arabic or latin or pop yeh yeh
kalau kita main major chord e.g Cmaj
We area actually playing C ionian scale
kalau kita main minor chord e.g. Am...
We area actually playing A aeolian scale (which equally to C ionian scale)
so correct me if im wrong...
so Minor Chord does not really fit minor scale.. it is still in major scale itself |
Sebenarnya cam ne,
- biasanya dalam music, kita alway refer to ionian scale @major scale dalam banyak pekara.
- minor scale aeolian sentiasa kita anggap sebagai the 6th modal.
- pekara macam not interval degree, chord naming, chord, scale formula semuanya kita reffer to major scale.
Dalam kes kita main Aminor chord.
- sebenarnya kita boleh main banyak scale.
- A aeolian boleh, A phrigian boleh, A dorian boleh.
- even melodic minor pun boleh or harmonic minor pun boleh.
- sebabnya semua scale diatas, memiliki ketiga tiga ahli traid A minor iaotu note A[root], C[minor 3rd] dan E[perfect 5].
- Tapi kalo u main Aaeolian maknanya kita nak berada dalan Key C laaaa.
- kalo u main Adorian maknanya kita nak berada dalan Key G laaaa.
Tak kisah la, aper scale, japan, indian, western dan sebagainya..
- formula dia mesti base on Major scale ionian,
- gitu juga chord name anda formula.
kalo korang biasa belajar sbelom ne,
- kita buat chord or scale mode berasaskan major scale aka ionion.
- dalam kes ne korang akan dapati minor dan major sentiasa ada relatifnya.
- Cmaj scale ahli = A aeionion.
- ahli jer sama, tapi dalam music.
- Cionion tak sama dengan Aaeolian term of,
- kalo Cionion root = C, kat Aaeolian root =A.
- kalo kita main solo Cmajor scale pada Aminor, root note sekarang adalah A bukannya C macam dalam major scale.
- walopun ahli yg sama, sekarang kedudkan dan darjat setiap note tu akan berubah bila berada pada modal berbeza.
Cmajor scale tak sama dengan Aminor scale.
- walopun ahli ahli nya sama.
- sebab bila berubah scale maka root sampai ker 7th chord dah berubah.
- tapi utk yg susah nak faham, korang nak solo Gmaj scale over Aminor tak salah. logik sebab ahlinya sam la juga...
Next step.
- utk melodic minor scale.
- kalo korang perform buat chord akan hasilkan chord pelik seperti minor/major chord.
- locrian b6 dan macam macam lagi.
- ne gua pun masih merangkak.
Harap boleh mambantu.
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Last edited by ultraman_cosmo on Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:18 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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| oRden |
| Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 3:32 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 19 Feb 2008
Posts: 612
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| ETERNAL wrote: | sebenarnya aku agak confuse dengan minor scale...
is minor chord is the same as minor scale?
Setau aku Major scale mmg ade..
tapi minor scale mcm tak wujud.. kecuali harmonic minor or melodic minor...
which sounds like arabic or latin or pop yeh yeh
kalau kita main major chord e.g Cmaj
We area actually playing C ionian scale
kalau kita main minor chord e.g. Am...
We area actually playing A aeolian scale (which equally to C ionian scale)
so correct me if im wrong...
so Minor Chord does not really fit minor scale.. it is still in major scale itself |
Mengikut kefahamanku pulak:
1. note2 dalam satu chord dibina/diambil dari scale.
2. Chord itu dibina dengan menyetackkan (men-stack-kan) note2 yang tertentu jaraknya (interval) dalam sesuatu scale tersebut.
3. So sebagai contoh, Am chord diambil notesnya dari Am scale.
Am scale = A BC D EF G
Am chord = A C E (stack third interval)
4. Tapi, dalam C major scale, ada note A, C, n E kan?
C major scale: C D EF G A B
5. notes A, C, n E ni adalah notes yang terkandung dalam Am scale.
6. Thats why kita kata dia Am chord, sebab cara construct dia, n notes tersebut terkandung dalam Am scale.
Chord = Scale?
7. Chord dibina menggunakan notes dalam satu2 scale tersebut.
8. Cuba korang senaraikan chord simple yang ada dalam C major scale?
C major scale =
C D EF G A B
chord2 simple (triads) dalam C scale =
Cmaj, Dm, Em, Fmaj, Gmaj, Am, Bdim
9. Ok, sekarang korang senaraikan notes dalam setiap chord tu:
Cmaj = C E G
Dm = D F A
Fmaj = F A C
Gmaj = G B D
Am = A C E
Bdim = B D F
notes yang ada dalam chord diatas = C E G D F A C B
susun balik = C D EF G A B
10. voila! korang da dapat C major scale.
11. So chord tak sama dengan scale, tapi chord berkait rapat dengan scale.
One chord fit the scale that its constructed.
Minor scale?
12. Ya, minor scale memang wujud. Construction dia je yang lain dengan Major scale.
13. Major scale interval =
2 2 1 2 2 2 1 octave
(W W H W W W H octave)
14. (Natural) minor scale interval =
2 1 2 2 1 2 2 octave
(W H WW H W W octave)
15. A Aeolian scale adalah (natural) minor scale bagi C major scale.
C maj scale = C D EF G A B
Am scale = A BC D EF G
16. Melodic minor tu sama dengan major scale, tapi tukar third note jadi flat.
C maj = C D EF G A B
C melodic minor = C D Eb F G A B
17. Sebab orang selalu guna melodic minor ni dalam keadaan dia descending, dia jugak dikenali sebagai descending melodic minor (Katanya Karl Cromok suka ini scale - descending E melodic minor..orang cakap la, aku tak tau..)
18. Harmonic minor pulak sama dengan (natural) minor scale, cuma dia kasi sharp kat note ketujuh:
Am = A BC D EF G
A harmonic minor = A BC D EF G#
19. Modes.....aku memang tak mau sentuh modes...banyak sangat kekeliruan n perdebatan hehehe..
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"orang yang head banging masa tengah dengar lagu metal akan dikatakan sebagai orang gila oleh orang yang tak dapat dengar muzik tu sedang berkumandang" - Nietzsche |
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| ETERNAL |
| Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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| oRden wrote: |
Mengikut kefahamanku pulak:
1. note2 dalam satu chord dibina/diambil dari scale.
2. Chord itu dibina dengan menyetackkan (men-stack-kan) note2 yang tertentu jaraknya (interval) dalam sesuatu scale tersebut.
3. So sebagai contoh, Am chord diambil notesnya dari Am scale.
Am scale = A BC D EF G
Am chord = A C E (stack third interval)
4. Tapi, dalam C major scale, ada note A, C, n E kan?
C major scale: C D EF G A B
5. notes A, C, n E ni adalah notes yang terkandung dalam Am scale.
6. Thats why kita kata dia Am chord, sebab cara construct dia, n notes tersebut terkandung dalam Am scale.
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Bro C major chord - C E G la.. bukan C E A
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| ETERNAL |
| Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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tq guys... oredi clear abit on natural minor... TQ
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| deadzid |
| Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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| ouraida wrote: | | deadzid wrote: | ah pening2....
so basically kalau aku pakai ME-70,
kalau root note aku Em...
aku kena set harmonizer key to G...
pastu amek mode yang 3rd eh?
is that correct??
haiyah...
kalau ade function utk tukar minor / major kan senang...
tak payah susah2 nak pilih note pasangan.... |
Mcm xcaya ja otai sorg ni xtau psal bnda ni.. 
Kalau mcm aku ni xheran la..  |
aku tak skolah punya gitarist...
tu pasal la jahil...
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| oRden |
| Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:40 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 19 Feb 2008
Posts: 612
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| ETERNAL wrote: | | oRden wrote: |
3. So sebagai contoh, Am chord diambil notesnya dari Am scale.
Am scale = A BC D EF G
Am chord = A C E (stack third interval)
4. Tapi, dalam C major scale, ada note A, C, n E kan?
C major scale: C D EF G A B
5. notes A, C, n E ni adalah notes yang terkandung dalam Am scale.
6. Thats why kita kata dia Am chord, sebab cara construct dia, n notes tersebut terkandung dalam Am scale.
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Bro C major chord - C E G la.. bukan C E A |
Ya, yang aku maksudkan sebenarnya notes dalam Am chord tu ada dalam Cmaj scales. Thats why dia bunyi ngam sebab takde bunyik yang clash.
Sama gak dengan Gmaj triad (G B D). notes dalam kord Gmaj tu ada dalam Cmaj scales.
p/s: bila aku baca balik, aku pun tak paham apa yang aku tulis...korang baca je la eksplenesen wak kusmur tu
BTW, dulu ada artikel pasal scales n modes nih from Dr Bodes n bro 'the king' omarjamaludin:
http://www.i-bands.net/forum/cms_articles.php?cid=2
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For those little foofah in the roundabout
"orang yang head banging masa tengah dengar lagu metal akan dikatakan sebagai orang gila oleh orang yang tak dapat dengar muzik tu sedang berkumandang" - Nietzsche |
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| ultraman_cosmo |
| Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Ya, yang aku maksudkan sebenarnya notes dalam Am chord tu ada dalam Cmaj scales. Thats why dia bunyi ngam sebab takde bunyik yang clash. |
- ada betulnya, tapi note Am juga ada dalam Gmaj scale.
- also Fmajor scale.
esok sambung... hehhehehe
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| ETERNAL |
| Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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sori... mata aku dah berpinau baca thread ni... hahaha
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| eniQma |
| Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:59 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 28 Nov 2009
Posts: 4040
Location: enigma di Kuala Lumpur
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ahaha aku pon dah mkn panadol dah...ahahaha
pening dah aku bace nih 
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| poundcake |
| Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:16 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 17 Feb 2004
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hahah...
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| ouraida |
| Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:41 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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| deadzid wrote: | aku tak skolah punya gitarist...
tu pasal la jahil... |
Fuhh!! Nasip baik!! Aku pkir aku sorg ja yg jahil d cni..
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